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Spyware Warrior
Help with Spyware, Hijacking & Other Internet Nuisances
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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 Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:18 pm Post subject: Does everybody agree with this? |
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| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
| Let’s say it was Enigma itself ... and I wanted to post 1000 articles a month, because I want to give tips and solutions to users on the web.... So frequency would be an issue then on digg? |
When the articles are for the sole purpose of peddling a program (free or otherwise), it's spam ...... plain and simple[/quote]
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| When the articles are for the sole purpose of peddling a program (free or otherwise), it's spam ...... plain and simple |
Wow!
Does everybody agree with this?
Wow!
Now I am really confused 
Eric, can you offer some guidance here? I feel I am back to square 1.........
Let me be straight.....
Let's say a new parasite comes out.... Xupiter 2.....
I put out a news release, I wrote a dig article, and contributed to some popular forums.
I literally put the exact instructions on how to remove it, and it happens I offer my product download as an alternative.
You mean to tell me… I cannot do it even if I give the product away for free ?
The entire contents of this article will be based on facts on how to remove the parasite, and the product will be clearly marked as an alternative. |
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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| JeanInMontana wrote: |
My name is not Jane there is no reason for you to think it is Jane. There is no place you have seen Jane used in reference to my name except in your posts.
My background is irrelevant.
But here is a nice simple definition of spamvertising, be sure to read it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spamvertising |
I am so sorry!
My eyes are failing me!
Sorry Jean!!!!! JEAN-in-Montana!! 
I stare at the computer so much I begin to see things! 
Again, I am very sorry! WOW! |
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MysteryFCM
Malware Expert
Joined: 28 Aug 2004
Last Visit: 01 Mar 2013
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Location: Tyne & Wear, UK
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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You've missed the point entirely.
First and foremost, I never said you could not post anything.
Second, I have absolutely no authority to tell you what you can or cannot do, I am simply giving an opinion.
Third, it is not YOU posting YOUR articles, it is your affiliates, posting for the sole purpose of peddling your program. They are not doing it to be helpful to anyone except their own pockets.
The content of the articles is completely besides the issue.
Using your example, no it is not spam. It only becomes spam when it is done using methods we've already mentioned to you over and over and over and over again .........
As an example, I had a member on a board I moderate, offer an add-on for free. This was absolutely fine, and very much welcome, until he started posting virtually identical posts for the same thing to a ton of other threads. In this case, his sole purpose for doing so, was to promote his program.
... and as an aside, I know where your questions are trying to lead, and baiting is not going to work 
_________________
Regards
Steven Burn
I.T. Mate / hpHosts
it-mate.co.uk / hosts-file.net |
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Just Bob
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Last Visit: 29 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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Alvin,
There are a couple of terms I haven't seen used in this discussion yet that would seem to be appropriate. These practices should be avoided.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sock_puppet_%28internet%29
Shills and Astroturfing
Another type of sockpuppet is an account created by the manufacturer of a product or the author of a book for the sole purpose of recommending the product/book by posing as an enthusiastic consumer or reader. (The tactic bears some resemblance to viral marketing.) A single such sock puppet is a shill; creating large numbers of them to fake a "grass-roots" upswelling of support is known as astroturfing. |
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| MysteryFCM wrote: |
You've missed the point entirely.
First and foremost, I never said you could not post anything.
Second, I have absolutely no authority to tell you what you can or cannot do, I am simply giving an opinion.
Third, it is not YOU posting YOUR articles, it is your affiliates, posting for the sole purpose of peddling your program. They are not doing it to be helpful to anyone except their own pockets.
The content of the articles is completely besides the issue.
Using your example, no it is not spam. It only becomes spam when it is done using methods we've already mentioned to you over and over and over and over again .........
As an example, I had a member on a board I moderate, offer an add-on for free. This was absolutely fine, and very much welcome, until he started posting virtually identical posts for the same thing to a ton of other threads. In this case, his sole purpose for doing so, was to promote his program.
... and as an aside, I know where your questions are trying to lead, and baiting is not going to work |
Steven,
I know we are both strangers... I am not baiting you....
I am just trying to find the middle ground...... And find a solution that works..... |
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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| MysteryFCM wrote: |
You've missed the point entirely.
First and foremost, I never said you could not post anything.
Second, I have absolutely no authority to tell you what you can or cannot do, I am simply giving an opinion.
Third, it is not YOU posting YOUR articles, it is your affiliates, posting for the sole purpose of peddling your program. They are not doing it to be helpful to anyone except their own pockets.
The content of the articles is completely besides the issue.
Using your example, no it is not spam. It only becomes spam when it is done using methods we've already mentioned to you over and over and over and over again .........
As an example, I had a member on a board I moderate, offer an add-on for free. This was absolutely fine, and very much welcome, until he started posting virtually identical posts for the same thing to a ton of other threads. In this case, his sole purpose for doing so, was to promote his program.
... and as an aside, I know where your questions are trying to lead, and baiting is not going to work |
Steven,
So if Enigma wrote a article like the example I specified, and it has at the end of the article it has a sponsored download link for Spyhunter on a Digg post.... Is it still spam? |
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 9:20 pm Post subject: Putting it together........... |
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Let's recap:
I THINK THIS IS FORMING THE FRAMEWORK:
JEAN:
| JeanInMontana wrote: |
| Colorado wrote: |
JeaninMontana suggested making valuable contributions to forums.
That is an interesting suggestion. Are you saying, if we direct our affiliates to come in forums like this one or any other security forum, make some valuable contributions and put links in their signature (such as Temerc has) that we are then not spamvertising? |
That is exactly what we are suggesting. If you would take notice TeMerc is not the only person on this forum or any forum with links in their signatures. I find it hard to believe you don't recognize the difference between spamvertising and a signature link.
| Colorado wrote: |
JeaninMontana specifically referenced taking things down from Digg. I don't understand this.
Is this just Jean or everyone here?
Do you all work on Digg together linking to each others stories and removing those you do not like?
At what point is the general consensus of this community that a link should be removed from a socialbookmarking place?
Why are your links good and ours not?
Can you please clarify what the difference is? |
No I did not say "take things down from Digg" I said Digging them down big difference. Digg works on a vote system "plus Diggs" and "negative Diggs". I have no means of removing a topic from Digg, and am not employed by Digg in any way.
I also stated, that my statements reflect my views only and no one else's.
Posts to Digg are supposed to be a news story, not a blurb about some great product that fixed my PC and a link to a download site for Spyhunter. Those are spam not news. |
ERIC:
| eburger68 wrote: |
Alvin:
No one is questioning the right of Engima Software or its affiliates to blog on whatever they want or to participate in forums.
If you or your affiliates do participate in forums, however, you must take care not to approach those forums as little more than an advertising and marketing opportunity. These and other security forums are not potential advertising portals or platforms for your product, and when persons promoting Spy Hunter simply intervene in an ongoing discussion (esp. one in which a victim is being assisted) to promote Spy Hunter, forum regulars tend to get a little pissed. That's what you're seeing here.
Take a look around in the forums here and elsewhere. You'll find reps from many anti-malware companies participating in discussions, even answering user questions and issues with their products.
What you will not find these reps doing is actively promoting their products. These forums can be used to support existing users of your products when those users come to such forums with questions and problems, but they shouldn't be used to promote your products.
Now, in the course of answering questions about your products and participating in discussions about all manner of topics, you gain visibility in the community. One of the potential effects of that visibility is increased sales -- but more sales would be a by-product at best, not a direct, planned outcome.
I think the active posters in this thread have readily identified the problems and issues driving their concerns and complaints, and from what I can tell it seems you know what needs to be done.
Nothing would help put this discussion to bed faster than an immediate cessation of the spamvertising coupled with a more upfront and truthful presentation of Spy Hunter on the sites we've discussed.
Why not take the weekend to start doing the things that need to be done so that you can get this whole episode behind you as quickly as possible?
Eric L. Howes |
CHRISRLG:
| ChrisRLG wrote: |
So the rule is - read the forum rules before they post - and before they add thier signature. |
STEVEN:
| MysteryFCM wrote: |
You've missed the point entirely.
First and foremost, I never said you could not post anything.
Second, I have absolutely no authority to tell you what you can or cannot do, I am simply giving an opinion.
Third, it is not YOU posting YOUR articles, it is your affiliates, posting for the sole purpose of peddling your program. They are not doing it to be helpful to anyone except their own pockets.
The content of the articles is completely besides the issue.
Using your example, no it is not spam. It only becomes spam when it is done using methods we've already mentioned to you over and over and over and over again .........
As an example, I had a member on a board I moderate, offer an add-on for free. This was absolutely fine, and very much welcome, until he started posting virtually identical posts for the same thing to a ton of other threads. In this case, his sole purpose for doing so, was to promote his program.
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TEMERC:
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In it's current form and in the type of frequency which it is usually done..................
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| Quote: |
Place them just like everyone else does. I've never seen any company with this many affiliates, who happen to post in the frequency that your affiliates do.
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suzi
Site Admin
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Last Visit: 20 May 2013
Posts: 10271
Location: sunny California
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| So if Enigma wrote a article like the example I specified, and it has at the end of the article it has a sponsored download link for Spyhunter on a Digg post.... Is it still spam? |
I believe this is your answer.
http://www.digg.com/tos
| Quote: |
Digg Terms of Use
USER CONDUCT
As a condition of use, you promise not to use the Services for any purpose that is unlawful or prohibited by these Terms of Use, or any other purpose not reasonably intended by Digg.
By way of example, and not as a limitation, you agree not to use the Services:
7. to submit stories or comments linking to affiliate programs, multi-level marketing schemes, sites/blogs repurposing existing stories (source hops), or off-topic content; |
Emphasis mine.
I take that to mean no advertising. So, the answer is yes, it is spam and against the terms of use.
It sounds to me like someone is trying to get free advertising. Why not buy some ads, or use Google Adwords? That's the ethical way to get advertising... to pay for it.
_________________
Former Microsoft MVP 2005-2009, Consumer Security
Please do not PM or Email me for personal support. Post in the Forums instead and we will all learn. |
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 9:53 pm Post subject: I was referring to Enigma itself …not its affiliates |
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Suzi,
I was referring to Enigma itself …not its affiliates
We as “Enigma” the company would like to post articles relating to parasites we remove.
7. to submit stories or comments linking to affiliate programs, -> it will not be an affiliate
multi-level marketing schemes, --> This is not my business
sites/blogs repurposing existing stories (source hops), --> Articles will be original .. More like a whitepaper of the parasite and how we remove it……
or off-topic content; --> targeted to the issue only
The articles I am suggesting are more to show the world Enigma's knowledge of how to remove parasites.... Yes it has commercial ends as it byproduct, but not necessarily for direct marketing.
IBM does this all the time, to promote its brand…. It is not about direct marketing…..
The readers get a good article, we get more recognition in our brand and company.
It seems the folks here agree with that position.... Cuts down on the frequecy and it will be quality......
and as far as paying for ads ...we do!
Alvin |
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:32 pm Post subject: My compeditors posting on forums |
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Hey folks,
Please take a look at some of my commercial compeditors posting on Cnet's forum:
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-6132_102-0.html?forumID=32&threadID=239124&messageID=2435757
They are discussing Spylocked.....
They have links to articles on their sites with a download button to their trial products.
Is this spam?
Or this is possible due to Cnet's TOS?
If Enigma would join this discussion with a link to a page documenting the parasite like they do... Are we spamming? |
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paperghost
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Last Visit: 20 Feb 2012
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Location: On a ROFLcopter
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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As someone who has quite possibly had more front page stories on digg.com than anyone else on the planet, I'd like to offer my thoughts on the whole digg thing - i hope you'll accept what i have to say as coming from someone who knows what works and what doesn't on digg.
let's cut right to the chase - aside from anything in the TOS, nobody that uses digg, or netvine, or slashdot, or any other site where lots of people comment on stuff, appreciates (or will likely vote for) an article that has a bit of textfluff then says "also, heres a download, lol". they will probably want to set the article on fire on dance on the body. why?
spyware-escape.com/how-to-surf-the-internet-safe
1) the article sucks. its crude, its basic, it doesn't say anything remotely new and / or interesting - in short, on digg it is not going to go anywhere apart from in the "no votes" pile, because people will click the link, look at it, then close the browser and go elsewhere. no "article" like the one on that site has ever, ever, ever reached the frontpage.
that alone should tell you what does (and doesn't) work on digg.
2) combine that with a big "download an automatic spyware scan tool" notice halfway down the page, and the users that go there will see it, and violently reject its entire reason for existing on the basis that its purely there to sell someone something.
this sort of thing not liked by digg users, especially after the "diggswarm" voting scandal from last year.
put simply, its spam submitted to digg with the intention of someone downloading a program and then paying for it.
you can dress that up however you want, but in its current format it. is. spam.
even if you go to the digg TOS and ferret out some loophole that allows you to post the same article in such a way that it wouldn't be classed as spam, it wouldn't matter because the editorial control is in the hands of the users and more often than not, that final safeguard is there to override the TOS when the TOS fails to do its job effectively.
Last edited by paperghost on Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:38 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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AlvinEstevez
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Location: Stamford, CT
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AlvinEstevez
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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| paperghost wrote: |
As someone who has quite possibly had more front page stories on digg.com than anyone else on the planet, I'd like to offer my thoughts on the whole digg thing - i hope you'll accept what i have to say as coming from someone who knows what works and what doesn't on digg.
let's cut right to the chase - aside from anything in the TOS, nobody that uses digg, or netvine, or slashdot, or any other site where lots of people comment on stuff, appreciates (or will likely vote for) an article that has a bit of textfluff then says "also, heres a download, lol". they will probably want to set the article on fire on dance on the body. why?
spyware-escape.com/how-to-surf-the-internet-safe
1) the article sucks. its crude, its basic, it doesn't say anything remotely new and / or interesting - in short, on digg it is not going to go anywhere apart from in the "no votes" pile, because people will click the link, look at it, then close the browser and go elsewhere. no "article" like the one on that site has ever, ever, ever reached the frontpage.
that alone should tell you what does (and doesn't) work on digg.
2) combine that with a big "download an automatic spyware scan tool" notice halfway down the page, and the users that go there will see it, and violently reject its entire reason for existing on the basis that its purely there to sell someone something.
this sort of thing not liked by digg users, especially after the "diggswarm" voting scandal from last year.
put simply, its spam submitted to digg with the intention of someone downloading a program and then paying for it.
you can dress that up however you want, but in its current format it. is. spam.
even if you go to the digg TOS and ferret out some loophole that allows you to post the same article in such a way that it wouldn't be classed as spam, it wouldn't matter because the editorial control is in the hands of the users and more often than not, that final safeguard is there to override the TOS when the TOS fails to do its job effectively. |
Excellent explanation!!!!!!
Can you show me one article from dig …. Speaking about a particular threat… Let’s say Spylocked….. That that was written by an anti-spyware commercial company…. That would not be considered spam? |
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suzi
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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I think you are mistaken on your interpretation of that thread at Cnet. I don't see any vendors pushing their own products there.
There are some sponsored ads at the bottom of the page, clearly marked as ads.
The replies in that thread are from regular users. I see RogueRemover is mentioned but RogueRemover has a free version that actually removes malware.
There are some links to Bleeping Computer -- a tutorial that does not promote any commercial applications. I see a link to information about SpyLocked on the Sunbelt website, but not a link to download anything there.
I don't know where you are seeing "companies linking there over and over". I see users, some asking for help, and people offering information.
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Former Microsoft MVP 2005-2009, Consumer Security
Please do not PM or Email me for personal support. Post in the Forums instead and we will all learn. |
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paperghost
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
Excellent explanation!!!!!!
Can you show me one article from dig …. Speaking about a particular threat… Let’s say Spylocked….. That that was written by an anti-spyware commercial company…. That would not be considered spam? |
well, i haven't got time to go hunting on digg to find articles submitted by random companies / individuals - but this will answer your question just as well minus the example and avoid any sort of semantics wrangling:
in my opinion, there is absolutely nothing wrong with anybody, regardless of company or anything else, submitting an article about anything to digg - with the caveat that the article isn't a lame excuse to sell, push or promote a product.
the moment a "buy now!" banner, or a "download this" button is thrust down your throat, then its submission spam.
of course, even without the sales pitch an article may still suck, but thats down to the quality of writing as opposed any dubious sales technique. |
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AlvinEstevez
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Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 11:16 pm Post subject: Commercial Companies on forums |
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| Quote: |
I see a link to information about SpyLocked on the Sunbelt website, but not a link to download anything there.
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Let's follow the link
http://research.sunbelt-software.com/threatdisplay.aspx?name=SpyLocked&threatid=129037
Look at the box on the right side of the page
CounterSpy V2
Download NOW
(File Size: 33.3 MB)
| Quote: |
I see RogueRemover is mentioned but RogueRemover has a free version that actually removes malware.
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I see it too, and I agree with you.....
So if I had a page in my site like Sunbelt does, and I had a free version of Spyhunter, which to quote you, "actually removes malware" in the free version or trial.
Would you have an issue if Enigma would joining a discussion like this in a forum like Cnet? |
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AlvinEstevez
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Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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| paperghost wrote: |
| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
Excellent explanation!!!!!!
Can you show me one article from dig …. Speaking about a particular threat… Let’s say Spylocked….. That that was written by an anti-spyware commercial company…. That would not be considered spam? |
well, i haven't got time to go hunting on digg to find articles submitted by random companies / individuals - but this will answer your question just as well minus the example and avoid any sort of semantics wrangling:
in my opinion, there is absolutely nothing wrong with anybody, regardless of company or anything else, submitting an article about anything to digg - with the caveat that the article isn't a lame excuse to sell, push or promote a product.
the moment a "buy now!" banner, or a "download this" button is thrust down your throat, then its submission spam.
of course, even without the sales pitch an article may still suck, but thats down to the quality of writing as opposed any dubious sales technique. |
This makes 100% sense!!!!
Thanks again! |
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paperghost
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| Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
This makes 100% sense!!!!
Thanks again! |
well, one final thing I'd like to mention is that its entirely too "small scale" to simply think that these submissions to digg only annoy any random security people that happen to be registered on digg. these kind of submissions annoy pretty much everyone on digg, security expert or not. so if the security person doesn't click the "mark as spam" button, I guarantee that it doesn't actually matter because any number of other digg users will be doing exactly the same thing - its just that the regular digg user will see it as "some stupid spam" and flag it as such then move on, whereas the security expert will be able to talk about the history of the spam, the site / sites / company it relates to and so on.
the end result is the same.
ultimately, these "spam submissions" are hurting your company, not helping - because every single time one of these sites is submitted to digg, a great big slice of users who frequent the security and technology sections become more and more familiar with your company name only through the use of digg spam. this is actually just reinforcing a negative association with spam to your company, and reinforcing that connection between your company and spam to people who might never have even set foot on a security forum - in fact, the "regular users" your program is most likely aimed at.
now, tell me what's better for your company - a slow dripfeed of useless articles pushing software that get banned, buried and reinforce your product with spam amongst one of the biggest websites on the planet in terms of the amount of users flooding through its gates every day, OR some site somewhere that isn't throwing a product down peoples throats and might actually get a frontpage story one day because of a well written article, with all the associated benefits of general good press and a boatload of traffic hitting your site over a two or three day period? |
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AlvinEstevez
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Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:35 am Post subject: |
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| paperghost wrote: |
| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
This makes 100% sense!!!!
Thanks again! |
well, one final thing I'd like to mention is that its entirely too "small scale" to simply think that these submissions to digg only annoy any random security people that happen to be registered on digg. these kind of submissions annoy pretty much everyone on digg, security expert or not. so if the security person doesn't click the "mark as spam" button, I guarantee that it doesn't actually matter because any number of other digg users will be doing exactly the same thing - its just that the regular digg user will see it as "some stupid spam" and flag it as such then move on, whereas the security expert will be able to talk about the history of the spam, the site / sites / company it relates to and so on.
the end result is the same.
ultimately, these "spam submissions" are hurting your company, not helping - because every single time one of these sites is submitted to digg, a great big slice of users who frequent the security and technology sections become more and more familiar with your company name only through the use of digg spam. this is actually just reinforcing a negative association with spam to your company, and reinforcing that connection between your company and spam to people who might never have even set foot on a security forum - in fact, the "regular users" your program is most likely aimed at.
now, tell me what's better for your company - a slow dripfeed of useless articles pushing software that get banned, buried and reinforce your product with spam amongst one of the biggest websites on the planet in terms of the amount of users flooding through its gates every day, OR some site somewhere that isn't throwing a product down peoples throats and might actually get a frontpage story one day because of a well written article, with all the associated benefits of general good press and a boatload of traffic hitting your site over a two or three day period? |
understood |
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AndyAtHull
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:40 am Post subject: |
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In my opinion this thread/topic is going nowhere. Valid points have been raised and most have been ignored or simply hit for six and forgotton about.
I think you as a company and person (Alvin) should take the time away, work on things and come back with a fresh approach. The way I see it your affiliates are not helping you but clearly damaging you.
And untill any changes are going to happen like you mentioned we will always monitor this situation regardless of the right or wrong doing.
I hope for you (and the thousends if not millions of users) this works out but I can't say I will be suprised if it doesn't.
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AlvinEstevez
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:49 am Post subject: Re: Commercial Companies on forums |
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| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
| Quote: |
I see a link to information about SpyLocked on the Sunbelt website, but not a link to download anything there.
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Let's follow the link
http://research.sunbelt-software.com/threatdisplay.aspx?name=SpyLocked&threatid=129037
Look at the box on the right side of the page
CounterSpy V2
Download NOW
(File Size: 33.3 MB)
| Quote: |
I see RogueRemover is mentioned but RogueRemover has a free version that actually removes malware.
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I see it too, and I agree with you.....
So if I had a page in my site like Sunbelt does, and I had a free version of Spyhunter, which to quote you, "actually removes malware" in the free version or trial.
Would you have an issue if Enigma would joining a discussion like this in a forum like Cnet? |
My God!!!
| Quote: |
| The replies in that thread are from regular users |
The person replying is an MS MVP, https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Donna.Buenaventura
Wait a second!
She is also a Moderator on the Cnet Forum!
http://forums.cnet.com/community/Donna+Buenaventura/?tag=usrprfl
So if an MS MVP is recommending my product, I had a page in my site like Sunbelt does, and I had a free version of Spyhunter, which to quote you, "actually removes malware" in the free version or trial.
Again, Would you have an issue if Enigma would joining a discussion like this in a forum like Cnet?
She posted for the first article for bleepingcomputer.com and then the compeditor you asked not to name by name???????
Something is odd here!!!!! |
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:22 am Post subject: Re: Commercial Companies on forums |
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| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
| Quote: |
I see a link to information about SpyLocked on the Sunbelt website, but not a link to download anything there.
|
Let's follow the link
http://research.sunbelt-software.com/threatdisplay.aspx?name=SpyLocked&threatid=129037
Look at the box on the right side of the page
CounterSpy V2
Download NOW
(File Size: 33.3 MB)
| Quote: |
I see RogueRemover is mentioned but RogueRemover has a free version that actually removes malware.
|
I see it too, and I agree with you.....
So if I had a page in my site like Sunbelt does, and I had a free version of Spyhunter, which to quote you, "actually removes malware" in the free version or trial.
Would you have an issue if Enigma would joining a discussion like this in a forum like Cnet? |
My God!!!
| Quote: |
| The replies in that thread are from regular users |
The person replying is an MS MVP, https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Donna.Buenaventura
Wait a second!
She is also a Moderator on the Cnet Forum!
http://forums.cnet.com/community/Donna+Buenaventura/?tag=usrprfl
So if an MS MVP is recommending my product, I had a page in my site like Sunbelt does, and I had a free version of Spyhunter, which to quote you, "actually removes malware" in the free version or trial.
Again, Would you have an issue if Enigma would joining a discussion like this in a forum like Cnet?
She posted for the first article for bleepingcomputer.com and then the compeditor you asked not to name by name???????
Something is odd here!!!!! |
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JeanInMontana
Warrior
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Last Visit: 22 Dec 2008
Posts: 177
Location: South Central Montana, USA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:26 am Post subject: |
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| Alvin wrote: |
| She posted for the first article for bleepingcomputer.com and then the compeditor you asked not to name by name??????? |
BleepingComputer is a completely free help site. It has the best collection of tutorials and self help fixes in the security forum IMO. It is also always on the cutting edge for the fixes to the most recent infections.
Once again a product was referenced that works and can be had for free to fix a problem. No one will profit from this information, but many will be rid of SpyLocked.
The fact that Donna is an MS MVP and Moderator only gives her statements more validity and that distinction is awarded via nomination and a decision from MS. Donna is well known and respected in the community. CNet is not the only place you would find Donna donating her time to help people.
This is a prime example of where distancing yourself from the community and it's standards leaves you out of the loop.
_________________
Hoax~Slayer * hpHosts * T.I.C. * Malwarebytes * A.S.A.P. Member 2004 |
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| JeanInMontana wrote: |
| Alvin wrote: |
| She posted for the first article for bleepingcomputer.com and then the compeditor you asked not to name by name??????? |
BleepingComputer is a completely free help site. It has the best collection of tutorials and self help fixes in the security forum IMO. It is also always on the cutting edge for the fixes to the most recent infections.
Once again a product was referenced that works and can be had for free to fix a problem. No one will profit from this information, but many will be rid of SpyLocked.
The fact that Donna is an MS MVP and Moderator only gives her statements more validity and that distinction is awarded via nomination and a decision from MS. Donna is well known and respected in the community. CNet is not the only place you would find Donna donating her time to help people.
This is a prime example of where distancing yourself from the community and it's standards leaves you out of the loop. |
Do you see a links to sunbelt and malwarebytes.com in this forum post?
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-6132_102-0.html?forumID=32&threadID=239124&messageID=2435757
When you click on this link: http://research.sunbelt-software.com/threatdisplay.aspx?name=SpyLocked&threatid=129037
Do you see a Download NOW box on the right hand side?
CounterSpy V2
Download NOW
(File Size: 33.3 MB)
Do you also see this link: http://www.malwarebytes.org/rogueremover.php
A free trial of a commercial compeditor.....
If we had a free remover or a trial.... and I had a landing page like those other 2 ... Would any of you have a problem Enigma had links similar to those?
Why can they do this, and we cannot? |
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AndyAtHull
SWW Honors Graduate
Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Last Visit: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 436
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:47 am Post subject: |
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Please don't bring other vendors into something that doesn't involve them.
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:48 am Post subject: I have no issue with what they are doing |
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I have no issue with what they are doing... I think is great .... This is a free country............
But would the community have an issue if had the same exact links like they do.....? |
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AndyAtHull
SWW Honors Graduate
Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Last Visit: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 436
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:50 am Post subject: |
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Those links in Cnet are not posted by the companies/sites themself and are based on the opinion of someone. Your affiliates are there to post links for money and not a care for the end user who is infected. Say no more.
_________________
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:53 am Post subject: |
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| AndyAtHull wrote: |
| Please don't bring other vendors into something that doesn't involve them. |
I do not care what any vendor does... God bless them! ..... I am just stating the an example of what it seems to be hypocracy, and inequality..........
Would you be kind enough to answer my question? |
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AndyAtHull
SWW Honors Graduate
Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Last Visit: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 436
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:55 am Post subject: |
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| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
Would you be kind enough to answer my question? |
I think a lesson could be learnt from that. Take a leaf out your own book and answer others.
| AndyAtHull wrote: |
| In my opinion this thread/topic is going nowhere. |
This is my last say on this matter. As stated in a previous post. It is going nowhere.
Regards, Andy
_________________
Andrew Kleijn
Securitycadets' Owner
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Corrine
Malware Expert
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Last Visit: 05 Feb 2013
Posts: 114
Location: Upstate, NY
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:00 am Post subject: Re: Commercial Companies on forums |
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| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
My God!!!
| Quote: |
| The replies in that thread are from regular users |
The person replying is an MS MVP, https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Donna.Buenaventura
Wait a second!
She is also a Moderator on the Cnet Forum!
http://forums.cnet.com/community/Donna+Buenaventura/?tag=usrprfl
So if an MS MVP is recommending my product, I had a page in my site like Sunbelt does, and I had a free version of Spyhunter, which to quote you, "actually removes malware" in the free version or trial.
Again, Would you have an issue if Enigma would joining a discussion like this in a forum like Cnet?
She posted for the first article for bleepingcomputer.com and then the compeditor you asked not to name by name??????? |
| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
| Something is odd here!!!!! |
For the first time, I found something to agree with you about; that is, something certainly is odd here. To paraphrase William Shakespeare,
"The man doth protest too much, methinks."
| AlvinEstevez wrote: |
I have no issue with what they are doing... I think is great .... This is a free country............
But would the community have an issue if had the same exact links like they do.....? |
THEY are not doing anything. Neither Donna nor the other posters in the CNet thread are affiliates of or associated in any way with Sunbelt (which offers a workable free trial) or with the free workable version of RogueRemover.
Perhaps, instead of all this noise here, you and your cohorts would do better correcting the issues that have resulted in other vendors adding SpyHunter to detection.
[Disclaimer: Statements made herein reflect my personal opinion, not those of any site I volunteer as Administrator, Moderator, or other title and are presented "as is" without warranty, and confers no rights.]
_________________
 , 
Take a walk through the "Security Garden" -- Where Everything is Coming up Roses!
Remember - "A day without laughter is a day wasted".
May the wind sing to you and the sun rise in your heart . . . |
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:03 am Post subject: Too many forum admins linking a paid service!!!! |
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| AndyAtHull wrote: |
| Your affiliates are there to post links for money and not a care for the end user who is infected. |
I think that sounds like a broken record....
I think something stinks here!!!
Too many forum admins linking a paid service!!!!
Acting alone.... Who is to say.... What is really going on!!! I cannot see from here......
I have no real proof... and I am making an assumption... I am sure there are many good clean folks here who trully want to help people. But, I do not buy you are all as clean as you claim to be.....
I will do all the things I said I was going to do.......
But, I will connect the dots.......
Seems all these admins all know each other....
That they speak for themselves.... I do not know?????
It is too convinient, that the admins are pushing the same link so many times!!! |
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:11 am Post subject: Re: Commercial Companies on forums |
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| Quote: |
Perhaps, instead of all this noise here, you and your cohorts would do better correcting the issues that have resulted in other vendors adding SpyHunter to detection.
|
Oh really?
What vendors other than what we announced on our news release are lisitng us?
and anybody who did in the past or present... We took strong action!
We are not ignorant of the law......
I am not trying to make trouble... The issue that is concerning me is if a customer of mine recommended my product on that Cnet forum.... You would all attack me in a forum storm..... That is what is concerning me the most.... |
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:21 am Post subject: I would not say anything if the products were FREE |
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I would not mention anything if the products were from a GPL and/or Freeware, or open source.
Free with and option to a PRO version....... Not good!
If we had a free removal tool.... Why would there be an issue? Other than "We are not welcome".... |
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AlvinEstevez
Warrior
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Last Visit: 15 May 2007
Posts: 65
Location: Stamford, CT
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:23 am Post subject: Have a nice day! |
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| I have a lot of work to do......Have a nice day! |
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paperghost
Site Admin
Joined: 28 Aug 2004
Last Visit: 20 Feb 2012
Posts: 2048
Location: On a ROFLcopter
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:09 am Post subject: |
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As you may have noticed, we have now officially entered KoolAid territory and I feel an over-abundance of said beverage. Try as I might, this thread has now degenerated to the point of uselessness.
One quick point:
| Quote: |
| The issue that is concerning me is if a customer of mine recommended my product on that Cnet forum.... You would all attack me in a forum storm..... That is what is concerning me the most.... |
It is generally easy to distinguish between a "regular" user who happens to recommend something naturally in the course of a discussion and an affiliate of a product who has no intention other than to spam you with a link to a (glaringly obvious) affiliate webpage.
So now that I've set your mind at ease about what is "concerning you the most", as far as I can see, this thread is now officially done and needs a fork sticking in it because everything else has already been addressed, or is pointless repetition.
I'm sure everyone involved in this thing has learned something from their input, and I'm sure the Enigma people will take away some of the suggestions made and hopefully put them to good use.
However - this thread is basically four pages of people repeating themselves and one page of genuine interaction. As a site admin, I simply cannot allow this to continue and this will likely descend into flames and bickering if allowed to go on. With that in mind (and given that as a neutral place to have this discussion, SWW has a finite amount of Admin resources that are needed elsewhere other than attempting to police this thread 24 / 7) I think everything that could be useful to both parties has pretty much been said, and I think this needs to end now so that everybody can try to build upon whatever good has come as a result of this discussion.
[Disclaimer: I am awesome]. |
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